The last sentence is my point exactly. However, I believe that Nikon does have a spec for how far the lens can extend behind the flange, which lens designers must adhere to. I just don't know what that distance is.

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It seems counterintuiive to have a shorter flange focal distance (FFD) on a FF camera than that of a 1” sensor (17mm), or m43 (19.25mm). So why did Nikon chose 16mm for FFD. I have no doubt Nikon has a very good reason for their choice, but i am curious as to what it is. Has Nikon explained their choice of a16mm FFD?

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and any planned lens designs they already have on the table. Or perhaps enough extra buffer space for any possible design they may have for the future. And how would you ever really know what your optical engineers may design in the future and how far past the flange the design would need?

It seems counterintuiive to have a shorter flange focal distance (FFD) on a FF camera than that of a 1” sensor (17mm), or m43 (19.25mm). So why did Nikon chose 16mm for FFD. I have no doubt Nikon has a very good reason for their choice, but i am curious as to what it is. Has Nikon explained their choice of a16mm FFD?

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A shorter flange distance frees constraints for the optical design of lenses. It potentially allows for smaller or higher quality wide angle lenses.

It seems counterintuiive to have a shorter flange focal distance (FFD) on a FF camera than that of a 1” sensor (17mm), or m43 (19.25mm). So why did Nikon chose 16mm for FFD. I have no doubt Nikon has a very good reason for their choice, but i am curious as to what it is. Has Nikon explained their choice of a16mm FFD?

Could it be that sensor pdaf Pixel have limited microlens opening to look in steep angles to the back element of the lens, thus the space needed because of design pdaf Pixel spread over nearly the whole sensor area?

Could it be that sensor pdaf Pixel have limited microlens opening to look in steep angles to the back element of the lens, thus the space needed because of design pdaf Pixel spread over nearly the whole sensor area?

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A little hard to understand with the heavy accent, but the diagrams helped. I felt like I was back in engineering school and learned something new today!

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The official line, as stated in the Nikon optical engineer's video, is that that was as short as they could make it and still have room for the sensor stack and the shutter.

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But that can't be the whole story, since two of the three announced lenses have optical elements that extend behind the flange.

and any planned lens designs they already have on the table. Or perhaps enough extra buffer space for any possible design they may have for the future. And how would you ever really know what your optical engineers may design in the future and how far past the flange the design would need?

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and any planned lens designs they already have on the table. Or perhaps enough extra buffer space for any possible design they may have for the future. And how would you ever really know what your optical engineers may design in the future and how far past the flange the design would need?

The official line, as stated in the Nikon optical engineer's video, is that that was as short as they could make it and still have room for the sensor stack and the shutter.

There's nothing but air between the flange and the sensor (well, there's a shutter and some flat glass) and the throat diameter's big enough that it's not in the way of anything so why have it any further than necessary?

If that was the determining factor you’d move the lens mount even further away than it already is.  A wide mount and wide lenses take care of a lot of that.

The official line, as stated in the Nikon optical engineer's video, is that that was as short as they could make it and still have room for the sensor stack and the shutter.

The last sentence is my point exactly. However, I believe that Nikon does have a spec for how far the lens can extend behind the flange, which lens designers must adhere to. I just don't know what that distance is.

It seems counterintuiive to have a shorter flange focal distance (FFD) on a FF camera than that of a 1” sensor (17mm), or m43 (19.25mm). So why did Nikon chose 16mm for FFD. I have no doubt Nikon has a very good reason for their choice, but i am curious as to what it is. Has Nikon explained their choice of a16mm FFD?

But that can't be the whole story, since two of the three announced lenses have optical elements that extend behind the flange. There must be some spec for how far mechanical and optical elements can project behind the flange, but I don't know what it is.

There is no question that allowing lenses to have optical and mechanical elements behind the flange is useful. It would be impossible to design practical lenses without at least mechanical elements behind the flange.

The last sentence is my point exactly. However, I believe that Nikon does have a spec for how far the lens can extend behind the flange, which lens designers must adhere to. I just don't know what that distance is.

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But that can't be the whole story, since two of the three announced lenses have optical elements that extend behind the flange.

Since Nikon does not encourage third party lenses there may be no published specification but I'm sure the Nikon lens designers know what constraints they are working with.

But that can't be the whole story, since two of the three announced lenses have optical elements that extend behind the flange. There must be some spec for how far mechanical and optical elements can project behind the flange, but I don't know what it is.

Other mounts have other constraints--eg. take micro four thirds' sensor stack thickness (Canon on the left, MFT on the right):

The last sentence is my point exactly. However, I believe that Nikon does have a spec for how far the lens can extend behind the flange, which lens designers must adhere to. I just don't know what that distance is.

Or, the case of variable curved sensors: suppose they want to do this in the future--likely with electronic shutter only.

and any planned lens designs they already have on the table.  Or perhaps enough extra buffer space for any possible design they may have for the future.  And how would you ever really know what your optical engineers may design in the future and how far past the flange the design would need?

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It seems counterintuiive to have a shorter flange focal distance (FFD) on a FF camera than that of a 1” sensor (17mm), or m43 (19.25mm). So why did Nikon chose 16mm for FFD. I have no doubt Nikon has a very good reason for their choice, but i am curious as to what it is. Has Nikon explained their choice of a16mm FFD?

It seems counterintuiive to have a shorter flange focal distance (FFD) on a FF camera than that of a 1” sensor (17mm), or m43 (19.25mm). So why did Nikon chose 16mm for FFD. I have no doubt Nikon has a very good reason for their choice, but i am curious as to what it is. Has Nikon explained their choice of a16mm FFD?

But that can't be the whole story, since two of the three announced lenses have optical elements that extend behind the flange. There must be some spec for how far mechanical and optical elements can project behind the flange, but I don't know what it is.

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I had this thought as well. I still have a Nikon V2  and use the FT-1 adapter, but i can only use the center AF point with it. Some have theorized that the long distance from the lens to the sensor creates too narrow of an angle for AF receptors outside the center point to work properly. With this in mind, I believe the real reason Nikon chose 16mm FFD was to accommodate adapted AFS lenses for the best possible AF performance with the on sensor PDAF. of course this narrative is not as attractive as the one presented in the video. I had expected there to be a mention of adapted lens performance in the video and I find the omission a little suspicious.

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The official line, as stated in the Nikon optical engineer's video, is that that was as short as they could make it and still have room for the sensor stack and the shutter.

But that can't be the whole story, since two of the three announced lenses have optical elements that extend behind the flange. There must be some spec for how far mechanical and optical elements can project behind the flange, but I don't know what it is.

The sensor stack thickness plus the shutter thickness plus the distance that the lens can extend behind the flange plus some safety margin determines how short the FFD can be.

So does that mean that the other mirrorless cameras with longer FFDs are bad designs?Surely they could have made the FFD shorter on smaller sensor cameras as well.

It seems counterintuiive to have a shorter flange focal distance (FFD) on a FF camera than that of a 1” sensor (17mm), or m43 (19.25mm). So why did Nikon chose 16mm for FFD. I have no doubt Nikon has a very good reason for their choice, but i am curious as to what it is. Has Nikon explained their choice of a16mm FFD?

Not really a lot of info there. It looks like Nikon settled on 16mm because it fit the camera body. Also, I think that Nikon gave the Z mount a 55mm diameter because  Canon has a 54mm diameter.

I think in either case, they've got the sensor, the rear lens elements, sometimes a shutter, and they don't want these touching ever, to avoid damage. And I think Jim's statement sums this up pretty nicely.

The sensor stack thickness plus the shutter thickness plus the distance that the lens can extend behind the flange plus some safety margin determines how short the FFD can be.

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I don't understand why you think that's important.The majority of existing F-mount lenses also have elements that extend behind the flange.This seems like sensible use of that space to me.

But saying that the sensor stack and the shutter thickness determines the FFD leaves out something important (hence the "not the whole story"). The sensor stack thickness plus the shutter thickness plus the distance that the lens can extend behind the flange plus some safety margin determines how short the FFD can be.

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The official line, as stated in the Nikon optical engineer's video, is that that was as short as they could make it and still have room for the sensor stack and the shutter.

So does that mean that the other mirrorless cameras with longer FFDs are bad designs?Surely they could have made the FFD shorter on smaller sensor cameras as well.

and any planned lens designs they already have on the table. Or perhaps enough extra buffer space for any possible design they may have for the future. And how would you ever really know what your optical engineers may design in the future and how far past the flange the design would need?

I don't understand why you think that's important.The majority of existing F-mount lenses also have elements that extend behind the flange.This seems like sensible use of that space to me.

The official line, as stated in the Nikon optical engineer's video, is that that was as short as they could make it and still have room for the sensor stack and the shutter.

But that can't be the whole story, since two of the three announced lenses have optical elements that extend behind the flange. There must be some spec for how far mechanical and optical elements can project behind the flange, but I don't know what it is.

It seems counterintuiive to have a shorter flange focal distance (FFD) on a FF camera than that of a 1” sensor (17mm), or m43 (19.25mm). So why did Nikon chose 16mm for FFD. I have no doubt Nikon has a very good reason for their choice, but i am curious as to what it is. Has Nikon explained their choice of a16mm FFD?

Perhaps there is another completely different explanation - by going with such a short flange distance, Nikon maximise the ability of other lenses to be adapted to their cameras. That allows, with appropriate adapters, these bodies to be more widely adopted by users from other systems, increasing the potential for Nikon sales for across-brand use, e.g., by Sony owners, while minimising the potential for the new Nikon lenses to be used on bodies from other brands? A smart strategy perhaps?

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The official line, as stated in the Nikon optical engineer's video, is that that was as short as they could make it and still have room for the sensor stack and the shutter.

It seems counterintuiive to have a shorter flange focal distance (FFD) on a FF camera than that of a 1” sensor (17mm), or m43 (19.25mm). So why did Nikon chose 16mm for FFD. I have no doubt Nikon has a very good reason for their choice, but i am curious as to what it is. Has Nikon explained their choice of a16mm FFD?

It seems counterintuiive to have a shorter flange focal distance (FFD) on a FF camera than that of a 1” sensor (17mm), or m43 (19.25mm). So why did Nikon chose 16mm for FFD. I have no doubt Nikon has a very good reason for their choice, but i am curious as to what it is. Has Nikon explained their choice of a16mm FFD?

So does that mean that the other mirrorless cameras with longer FFDs are bad designs?Surely they could have made the FFD shorter on smaller sensor cameras as well.

The sensor stack thickness plus the shutter thickness plus the distance that the lens can extend behind the flange plus some safety margin determines how short the FFD can be.

It seems counterintuiive to have a shorter flange focal distance (FFD) on a FF camera than that of a 1” sensor (17mm), or m43 (19.25mm). So why did Nikon chose 16mm for FFD. I have no doubt Nikon has a very good reason for their choice, but i am curious as to what it is. Has Nikon explained their choice of a16mm FFD?

The sensor stack thickness plus the shutter thickness plus the distance that the lens can extend behind the flange plus some safety margin determines how short the FFD can be.

The official line, as stated in the Nikon optical engineer's video, is that that was as short as they could make it and still have room for the sensor stack and the shutter.